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May 19, 2006

Comments

MT

Thank GOD Will's hair in the pilot didn't make it past the pilot. It was HEINOUS.

Kevin

Yes, it was a far from perfect show; It was a TV sitcom after all. But in the fall of '98, while still closeted, I couldn't help but watch Will and Jack living openly, and wonder "What if?" Well, now I know. So I have a bit of an emotional attachment to the show. Does that make me a bit girly?

Just a little bit.

Sentimental much?

Clay

Sean Hayes is actually a classically trained pianist

Tommy

I thought it was all very I Love Lucyish. I liked it. Does that make me daft?

Alan

My thoughts on the last show are more to do with its structure, than its story. If the show had started with Will and Grace meeting at Lila and Ben's dorm, and the narrative explained the previous 20 years, it would have been better than the hop-scotch path they chose.

In the end it was reassuring that they were friends 20 years later, however implausible the Jack and Karen shack-up and Will and Grace related-by-marriage ending. Who doesn't wish for that kind of longevity in their friendships?

I'm forgiving of the criticisms many gays have about the show because if it had done otherwise it might have been very satisfying for about 8 episodes. Many, many viewers who think they don't know a gay person had a gay presence in their lives for 8 years. That can only be a good thing.

This was still a far better send off than either M*A*S*H or Seinfeld managed for their runs.

Aatom

i felt the same way about Unforgettable. It was truly touching, as Karen and Jack were the real stars of this show anyway.

the rest was all over the place. The meeting of their children, which was nicely set up to look like a flashback at first, was kind of cute in a cloying way, but I'm SO over old-age makeup on series finales.

The Beverly Leslie was bufoonish and trite, which is a shame because he was one of my favorite bit characters. we got none of the classic back-and-forth between him and Karen that made his character so lovably awful. Karen herself got watered down over the last few years, morphing into something resembling an actual human with real emotions which totally destroyed the poignant moments we sometimes glimpsed when her icy facade would crack during the heyday of the show.

in all, good riddance. the best part of the finale was probably the highlights show beforehand, which was an emotional ride through one of the more important sitcoms of the modern era. One that had, sadly, lost its mojo many seasons ago.

Aatom

best line of the finale: "Don't you find those two exhausting?"

Yes, Karen, we did.

Tommy

That's what I loved. It was trite and silly in a knowing way.

bryan pippin

it may have bot been all it could have been on the gay rights front but it was a incredibly funny well written show that showcase a certain type of humor that is found in gay culture by doing so it might have made us into court jesters but that how we got our foot in the door and besides we make great court jesters

Robbie

Agreed on "Unforgettable." I loved it and was surprised how touching it was.

Anything Jack and Karen was good, though. I found the repeated, "Jack?" "Mmmyeah?" irrationally funny. And of course Rosario's last line to Karen was perfect.

As for Will and Grace, eh. Didn't care. "Do you find those two exhausting?" Yes. Their relationship wore out its welcome ages ago. Think about it. They were arguing over baby-raising stuff back before the Leo character was even introduced. In the last few episodes, they're right back to arguing about it. Don't. Care.

Every Will and Grace argument was pretty much the same issues and dialogue recycled over and over and over. The writers ran the friendship (and the viewership) right into the ground.

That's why I made sure to include the Karen highlights in the retrospective clip. She really was the only reason I'd catch the occasional episode. The rest of the show I cared very little about.

Tommy

I will say, I sat down to watch more out of a sense of obligation than caring about any of them so I can't say I found any of it touching, just stupid and silly, which was fun.

Malcontent

This was still a far better send off than either M*A*S*H or Seinfeld managed for their runs.

I don't know about "Seinfeld," but do you honestly believe this about "M*A*S*H"? I thought that show was superb until the end, and I wept disconsolately during the last episode.

Then again, I was maybe 12 at the time.

Queer Conservative

The thing that killed Will & Grace for me was the way the Jack and Karen roles became complete caricatures. It went way over the top in the silliness factor.

If you watch the early episodes - Jack and Karen were great characters and good contrasts to Will and Grace. Funny where W&G were brooding. Carefree where W&G were overwrought. Self-centered where W&G were…well okay all four characters were self-centered, but you get the idea.

el polacko

guess i'm the grouch in this group. i hated myself for having sat through the whole mess. the writing was abysmal, as usual. they didn't seem to have any idea where they wanted to go for the finale. we're in the past, the future, the present, in a dream, the past again, the future again .. will and grace split and re-united no fewer than five times in the course of an hour.
the bit with the kids unknowingly hooking up was forced and phony, as were all of the 'emotional moments'. i got one chuckle out of the whole mess when karen polished off the vodka. otherwise, it was one of the most unfunny and sappy sitcom episodes ever. a "groundbreaking" series at first, sure... but it quickly descended into repetitive mediocrity. i won't miss it.

Red

I enjoyed the show, looking past the fact it felt cobbled together with poor flow. You did leave out however one of the last scenes, which mirrored the very first scene from the pilot. Will and Grace sitting in thier respective appartments, talking on the telephone. The dialouge reflecting a relationship that may or may not be intimate. It was here that the characters reveal that thier children, remarkable mirror images of the parents, are soon to be married, uniting the unlikely family with yet one more bond.
I thought how the scene went, same but different images and words and sentiments was a nice "full circle" effect.

mike in philly

Firstly, let me congratulate The Malcontent Video on what I consider the best gay blog on the net.
Now about Will And Grace.Apparently the people who posted so far are a lot younger then me. They don't remember when a gay character either in a movie or on television was either a villain or someone to be laughed at.When every gay character was extremely self hating.The Will and Jack characters were completely comfortable in their sexuality. As for stereotyping, if you don't know a "Jack" in your life, then you just don't get out much.And what made Jack so funny was not his effeminacy, it was his overblown sense of himself and his sheer stupidity.The audience laughed with them not at them. And they laughed at themselves.
Some of you need to rent "The Boys In The Band" and see how things used to be.Then watch a re-run of Will And Grace. Then you will see how far we have come.
BTW- I think the Karen Walker character stole every show. And yes, I was disappointed by the ending too.

Malcontent

Thank you, Mike, you're very kind. :-)

If I might throw in another two cents, my relationship with W&G was not unlike my relationship with my father: I treasured it for what it was, but more than that, I mourned it for what it wasn't and what it never would be.

Yes, there were a few happy years, but it soon devolved into disappointment after disappointment. I stopped talking to my dad, but I did still check in on Will & Grace from time to time to see if things had ever gotten better. They never really did.

I agree with Mike, though, we can't take for granted the trail that the show blazed.

sonny

yeah, sean hayes was playing the piano in the finale. he was a music/theatre major at illinois state while i was there. :)

Aatom

How is it that you and I aren't married yet, Robbie?

Tommy

That Megan can chug better than most my frat brothers in college.

Alan

Yes, Mal, I really feel W&G got a better send off than Seinfeld and M*A*S*H. Primarily because it didn't suddenly look like something else entirely.

The last hour of Seinfeld tried to make a show about nothing about something. Who wants to watch a morality play? Yes they were rude, self-involved, detached-from-reality bores, that's why I liked them? Punishing them for it in that last episode was punishing alright.

M*A*S*H had long established its dramedy credentials, but it was a sitcom afterall. Hawkeye goes nuts? That's not funny. Its last 90 minutes was two parts movie-of-the-week, and one-part sob-fest.

By the way, I was 20 when it ended its 11-year run, and it was like a death in the family.

Robbie

Tch, Aatom, you've never asked :P

Leonard

I didn't get a chance to see it! I caught the last minute, literally. Thanks for the videos though! It's sad how many gay people are trashing W&G, it's a sitcom, not a vehicle to say being gay is cool or denounce homophobia, it's just supposed to make you laugh. For me, that's exactly what it did. ;-)
peace

louis

Two points: loved/love the movie Boys in the Band - a true queer classic and a must see for all homos.

And topically, to some of you who didn't get the memo, the W&G series finale wasn't particularly going for "funny".

Epifanio

I was so over the Will & Grace characters. They whined and whined till nobody could take it anymore. Jack and Karen seemed to be the only ones still pushing their characters and the funny envelope. These two continued to explore the material for laughes. Isn't that what a sitcome is about? Their duet was genuine and heartfelt.

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